I think Innovation / Product ratings are a great idea

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Great idea – and it may be useful to have a few standard questions as part of the rating, e.g.
- would I buy it (no, maybe, yes, can’t live without it)
- do I understand what it does for me? (straight away, took me a while, huh?)
- would I recommend it to (my partner, son, daughter, mum, dad, my worst enemy)

In other words, does it solve a problem or offer an opportunity to me or someone I know.

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Perhaps we could add “Would you invest in it?”

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How about a forum such as that in FlyingSolo.com.au which has different discussion topics eg: rate my website and another, rate my product or idea. Biggest hassle her is the need to moderate otherwise this will just become another spammed channel.

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I think it is a fantastic idea. Why not have an ‘input page’, have a word limit for the pitch and maybe a weblink. Then have 3 to 5 questions that the inventor can input that they would like answered. Therefore giving the inventor much more tailored feedback and makes them get specific about what feedback they would like.

We have invented an independent financial education site and we would love to gather feedback in this way. Thanks Rob

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i reckon it’s a great idea to give space to help people trying to innovate. feedback from readers could also help tighten and refine the idea, raising questions those too close to the project cant see.

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James,

You have already of course promoted the lady and her product with the encapsulated breakout in your original post so your question about whether you should or should not promote her is now moot. The issue is whether you should do the extra bit that she seeks.

To be honest AntHill online is becoing very self-referential – ie many of your ‘new’ articles are either a list of popular old articles (like channel 9′s ’20 best seris’ – no new content here), or talk about other events or things that Anthill is already doing, eg your ’30 under 30′

The point being that at times the value of anthill is severely diminished for at least this reader.

To therefore use the main anthill site/newsletter as a pletform for the promption of unrelated third party products will further dilute your offering. Moreover, whether its paid support or not, you suddenly are no longer a neutral party and have a vested interest.

I guess though you are already in that position – viz: eg could you really seriously now run an article about how much we all hate Bigpond (which we do – check out the whirlpool forums) and risk losing the valuable Telstra advertising on your email newsletter – I think not.

So in the end, if you want to help out new and emerging companies promotions then perhaps do it off brand – but make sure you have a very strong decision criteria in place as to what you will and won’t run with

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James Tuckerman Reply:
October 13th, 2009 at 10:48 am

Hi Ray,

One of Anthill’s main functions (reasons for being) is to foster a culture of innovation in Australia.

I’m not suggesting for a moment that we use this type of forum to promote Arnott’s Tim Tams, Diet Coke or Telstra broadband services.

Unless… they are doing something radically innovative.

Rather, we’re exploring ways for early stage innovators, who often don’t get the exposure they deserve, to road test their new products and services.

If we don’t give innovators a place to get exposure for Aussie made innovation, who will?

Rules will need to be set in place (to avoid bias or flagrant self-promotion) but that’s what this discussion is about, right?

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James Tuckerman Reply:
October 13th, 2009 at 10:51 am

PS. Also worth noting that we’ve never been afraid to point out the follies of our advertisers when they do something silly (even if they do pay the bills). No one is immune from criticism online (even us).

For example, Telstra is an advertiser with us. You might enjoy this piece by Anthill editor Paul Ryan on the break up of Telstra, the NBN and the public good: http://anthillonline.com/the-telstra-break-up-the-nbn-and-the-public-good/

Hope you don’t find this link too self-referential.

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Hey…this is a wonderful opportunity to help your entrepreneurial audience get a check on reality. I like the prior comment that suggested some criteria. Why not set up a panel, non editorial, who can pass judgment on the business and product (sound familiar?)

Steve Anderson
Marquis Advisory Group

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Great Idea! so long as the product/services were innovative.

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I agree with Ray Hardy on all counts.

Why not as a journalist, just write interesting stories about how entrepreneurs are doing things differently – as normal articles?

There’s enough advertising and self promotion on the site and in the emails already. Personally I want to be receiving new articles in the enewsletters about business and entrepreneurial topics.

What you’re suggesting would be perfect for a forum, away from your day to day stuff.

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An independent panel of relevant professionals would be perfect, to give feedback on ideas in an online forum. I think opening it up to everyone to give their opinion could possibly have the wrong effect and even stop someone from continuing with a perfectly good idea. Not every product/innovation will be relevant to or useable by everyone.

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Sounds great, I certainly have a couple of new ventures almost ready to launch that the crowd could comment on.

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I recently signed up to a website that helps launch new inventions and innovations it’s call quirky (http://www.quirky.com/)
People put up their ideas, others comment and offer ideas for improvement etc. Contributors get a minor percentage of profits if the product launches. To determine if a product is fit to launch and go into production it has to gather enough pre-orders. Once the pre-orders are met the item goes into production (I think they even organise that).
The company was set up by Ben Kaufman who launched a business creating i-pod accessories called morphie (which I understand he made a quid out of).
Please remember that if you have a great idea that you feel you can make a commercial success protect your intellectual property with some form of patent first. The aforementioned site has specific conditions that you would want to understand before putting your idea up there. Read ALL the fine print.

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Paul Ryan Reply:
October 13th, 2009 at 9:59 am

Hey John,

We actually covered quirky.com as Website of the Week earlier this year. See: http://anthillonline.com/website-of-the-week-a-quirky-new-path-to-market-for-product-ideas/

This whole ‘crowdsourcing business ideas through to execution’ thing is really gathering steam.

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Sounds like a great idea….maybe a simple star ratings system on the site (similar to YouTube) with a social networking link tagger so readers could post to their FB, Twitter, MySpace etc pages if they thing it’s a great product and start their own viral marketing of it. At the end of each month select the five highest rated/viewed products and post them on an I-inventor Page (Innovative Inventions?)in the paper version……….K.I.S.S – I think this would be the simplest and most effective manner of representing the world of creation.

Also, you could get the inventor to lobby a gift/giveaway of free samples..ie 500 free promotional LUKIAN’s with artwork 1st prize, 250 2nd, 100 for 3rd etc. That way the onus is on the inventor/promoter – this could be included with the inventions pitch as a ‘hook’.

And…..if you wanted to get really tricky you could track an Anthill members link referrals and award the prize for the most referrals accordingly – ie rewards the Anthill members effort in promoting their favourite invention as well as Anthill in the process! (Strict anti-spamming rules would need to apply of course)

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Rating innovations is a good starting point for Anthill readers to interact with each other. There’s already alot of social interactions between Anthill and readers but there’s no platform for readers themselves.

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Hi James,

We could offer these people a free ‘independent’ critique of their idea and this could then be used as a ready reckoner to position someone’s idea as something to pop onto your website or not. We do this daily anyway for our hundreds of Clients through our ‘screening’ process http://www.cre8biz.com.au/ideaABILITY.asp.

What do you think ?

Cheers

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If there is one thing I have learn’t in marketing it is that if you open up a forum to everyone there are usually very mixed responses from both extremes. I like the idea of a simple rating system with space for maybe 100 words to explain your choice. Why do I want yet another CD storage facility? If it’s that good surely the market will pick it up.
Maybe Anthill could offer a prize to the idea that took of based on consumer feedback.

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James, I agree with Ray that singling out products, as you have done with the photos in this article, will dilute your journalistic integrity on the whole. Unless:
- coverage of a few representatives of a group/genre/trend, not just one innovation
- coverage is of an innovation as merely one forerunner of a profound coming shift in societal or technological trends. When we have coverage of our AI’s in this category, the journo is always careful to interview clients (not just me), and note the bad things as well as the good, so as to preserve their reader’s sense of unbiased reporting.

If you do a rating system, you need to think about the point – what would be the outcome of having the highest rated invention? Inventor ego? Media coverage? Distribution to Anthillians as seed advocates? If it is just for ego/research, it will be rated by a skewed sample (Anthillians would not represent the normal population), and may delude or depress inventors as to the commercial value of their innovation. All inventors like to flatter ourselves that we have something unique, but more to the point is this something that someone will buy, and what problem does it truly solve?

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Brilliant idea! Being a new small business owner myself I am also much more aware now of other small businesses and the amount of work and innovation that is involved – I would love to see what people are coming up with.

It might also provide a great partnering opportunity.

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Hi James,

Ironic in that by posing your question regarding whether or not to promote the idea that you have infact promoted the idea….

Keep up the good work Anthill.

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Hi

I think it is a good idea to have a section where people can post inventions but I think it will fail without a proper ‘criteria for evaluation’.

It seem that most people don’t have the language to talk about what they like or dislike about a design (look at how often the new inventors misses the mark) but this can generally be fixed by setting up a clearly defined set of objective that a new design should meet and reviewing if it meets them.

I would love to offer a professional critique of the products if you like.

Kind regards

Andrew Simpson

Web: http://www.vertdesign.com.au

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That’s the best idea I’ve heard of in ages (the rate my invention, not the disc package, although that is good too).

Will there be any warning/protection for people posting up “I’ve got this great idea for a product…” and then having it snatched by someone who realised there wasn’t any patent protection or IP on the idea and could move to market faster than the idea creator?

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Aleksandra Vukotic Reply:
October 19th, 2009 at 1:49 pm

Dear Dean and all Anthillians

Just to mention LUKIAN Disc Case is a new product, hence it has patent protection for AU and US so far and it has as well a registered Trade Mark-Lukian. This package is not just for the purpose of holding disc’s but, hey, (just use your imagination)it is a great marketing tool that you could hold in your hands. I am a psychology student (management stream) and I know how people think and behave including the exploration of psychological dimensions in management. Can you imagine how many magazines or any other information can be stored in just one ordinary DVD disc (GB 4,7). Actually, I must say as well that Anthill is my FIRST public contact (through the forums) since it’s patent protection. Thank you James for this promo and I would like to thank you all for your supports and critics.

Aleksandra Vukotic

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Hi

I think it is a good idea to have a section where people can post inventions but I think it will fail without a proper ‘criteria for evaluation’.

It seem that most people don’t have the language to talk about what they like or dislike about a design (look at how often the new inventors misses the mark) but this can generally be fixed by setting up a clearly defined set of objective that a new design should meet and reviewing if it meets them.

I would love to offer a professional critique of the products if you like.

Andrew Simpson

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Yes, great idea for rate my innovation/invention.

Sigh, this particular invention is a bit of a yawn fest. Fancy foldy paper holder. Complicated, expensive and throw away in the end. YAAAAAAAWN. 1/10. An extra point taken off for using a single ‘peace’ of paper. 0/10. Spell check can’t help if you just have no idea.

Also, I’m not sure that she was asking you to help her promote it but rather trying to SELL it to you. It was just a really bad sales pitch and they got some promo as a consolation prize.

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Aleksandra Vukotic Reply:
October 19th, 2009 at 2:05 pm

Hey Dan

Thank you for you critics. You sad it is complicated. I say, do you know from how many peaces is made one ordinary “jewel” case? Did you ever read how many people were being heart from broken plastic, or how many children were being hospitalized by swallowing the small peaces from plastic.
What I have showed to was just one “tickling” sample, however they are other surprises for the right show!

WARNING-Do not play with fire!

…and yes, I do sometimes write “peace” instead of “Piece” and I proudly speak with accent, hence I don’t “THINK WITH ACCENT”.
Kapishi?

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Dan Reply:
October 20th, 2009 at 11:34 am

Hey Aleksandra,
Well, I feel bad now. I was being a bit cavalier with my comments for the group rather than to you.

My thinking was that a simple paper sleeve for mag covers etc would be much cheaper and easier and sometimes inventors invent things just for the sake of. Maybe it is a bit funkier or will stand out and if that works then cool. My thoughts are that you will struggle with this BUT go for it anyway since you have come this far. You just never know and always up to encourage an entrepreneur not beat them down! Apologies for being flipant.
Have a blast,
Dan.
PS Not sure what the warning is about.. but ok

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Aleksandra Vukotic Reply:
October 20th, 2009 at 1:02 pm

Hi Dan

I would like to make a simple point here.

First point:If for example,BMW car maker stayed with the line design concept made in 1960, and if there would be no competition and human desire for new lines and designs, we would all still drive cars from 1960.

Another point: Houses from middle century, obviously differ in overall look and design from the houses in 21st century, and what do you think…why? Because, people tend to commode themselves through the new designs so they can feel more comfortable and as well, as earlier mentioned, to compete with others-that is what we call Prestige! If there was no inventors at that time coming up with new designs and ideas for example when they would build their houses, they would probably still live in their “middle century” designed houses! (the worst scenario-in the caves).

People are curious…and yes, they would definitely like something new and different to hold in their hands in regards when we are talking about the disc case packaging.

My point: was not just to promote the package Lukian, however, it would promote many industries (including Anthill Magazine) who got their stamps on Lukian (simple marketing). And hey, all business ideas are in my small but very well working brain. But naturally Dan, you haven’t move a little more further than from just a thing lukian is a “packaging which holds discs” hence, it is more than that. People’s desire for beauty and prestige is strong and that is the force behind any inventor or genius to make many new and extraordinary things. People’s curiosity would practically “force” to see what is this Lukian about? How would it feel in my hands? What would you do if someone offer you a Ferrari for a day? Or would you still proffer to drive (any ordinary car)as, hey they both do take us from one place to another! Do you think Dan, that that is the ONLY point in our lives? I don’t think so! The same point would lie within, as you mentioned “simple paper sleeve” and Lukian.

You see I like beautiful and distinctive things, and I “enjoy in their surroundings every day”. I am lucky and blessed to think and live that way. If someone still want to live in “the caves’ it is their way of thinking and living. We all have choices, don’t we?

All the best to all inventors and Anthillians

Alex

WARNING!!!
The contrived and fraudulent nature of the patent system requires that you be deprived of the rights to your creations if they become public without patents pending or granted. Yes, your elected representatives have given the rights to your creations to the patent attorney industry to exploit as they desire.
So get out your half a mill (perhaps a mill these days) and send it to the pai. Sell the house, car, kids too maybe, must get the invention in the market, so you can be rich and famous!

Or just mark it ‘Patented by Smith & Wesson’. And mean it.

Or forget it.

Good thing Australia does not have a Human Rights Act as the most egregious violation of your human rights is the Patent Act.

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Vert design Reply:
October 13th, 2009 at 11:25 am

Yep

IP in Australia is a joke offers no protection and costs a fortune.

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Great idea! Let’s have a show case area for new innovations. It is what we need rignt now as we emerge from the GFC.

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I have invented a right angled tooth pick. It’s totally unique in the world and there is nothing else like it. I have a worldwide patent. The market is worth a cagillion dollars and I only need 5% of the market to become a gozillionaire.

I am looking for investors and am prepared to give away 10% of the trading company for the modest amount of $500,000. Of course I will own 100% of the intellectual property in a holding company and you will be buying shares in the trading company which has a license. My lawyer told me this is the way to structure the business to ‘protect’ myself from people trying to steal my idea.

With your investment I will be repaying director’s loans which is the money we have invested over the past 5 years. I have a team ready to go and because we are all related, you know there won’t be any staff issues.

I have a simple strategy which is to sell my idea or license it to lots of companies who will then pay a huge royalty. You will get 10% of this for your investment. All the hard work is done by inventing it, so it shouldn’t be difficult to get a company to come on and do the easy part of taking it to market.

blah blah blah blah blah … had enough time in inventor land yet?

1. Inventors are NOT entrepreneurs and it’s extremely rare for them to be both.

2. Ideas (even with prototypes) are worth ZERO, or near ZERO.

There’s no magic formula to success, but Paul Buchheit’s formula of:

Idea * Judgment * Ability * Determination * Luck = $$$

is a pretty good guide in my view. The ability to ‘hustle a deal’ or ‘front’ is also key to sucess too because there is alway a power imbalance which early stage companies need to deal with.

I am involved with inventors on a daily basis and they say the same things and have the same personality types. In most cases, you would only be furthering the delusion that they can’t stop until they are broke if you start giving them publicity

By the way, apparently this invention is for sale – http://www.patentauction.com/patent.php?nb=3701 … so you could jump on for the downhill run to megabucks … afterall it’s got a patent in the US and Australia, PLUS it’s “totally different than any other paper designed disc case at the world market” …

Yep …

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Dan Reply:
October 20th, 2009 at 11:40 am

Great comments. And then they wonder why no one wants to invest. Actually no Mr Inventor you get 5%… then they storm out.

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Crazy Inventor Reply:
November 1st, 2009 at 8:45 pm

This is just too funny. Certainly seems to sum up the case at hand.

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Simon Reply:
December 8th, 2009 at 10:38 am

Yep, very relevant to this case. Highly entheusiastic but no idea what is to be faced in actually selling it. Will learn heaps though and that is how entrepreneurs are made.

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Maybe a good idea for some, but I probably wouldn’t use it or recommend it.

These are my reasons why.

1. Unless you’re ready to launch your product or innovation, the less you give away to your competitors the better.

2. If you’re ready to launch, you will have already done the necessary market research. Patents will have been researched and put in place, if necessary.

3. If you’ve already done the market research properly, you won’t want or need off the cuff assessment by others, even seemingly expert ones.

These issues aside, I’ve found the last thing you need in the early stages is lots of people saying you have a great idea, and nor do you want lots of people critical of your idea. Either way, this type of feedback is not what you want. Positive feedback from unqualified, albeit well-meaning, individuals may spur you on down a dead-end. Similar negative feedback may make you give up on a great idea, had you persevered. To some extent I’ve had experience of both.

Unfortunately, there is no substitute for proper process and due diligence.

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Dan Reply:
October 20th, 2009 at 11:42 am

Agreed. How about promoting the ones who have everything in place and want to promote the launch. Next big thing? or a dif name as innovic might get grumpy.

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Tim Reply:
October 20th, 2009 at 12:12 pm

I agree that it’d be good to help launch new products.

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I am an inventor. I have followed up several inventions – to a point. My latest invention is being made in small numbers and is selling, and I am exploring options for building up its production and sales. To do this I have turned myself into a Company Director in a metamorphisis that took me to places I did not know existed.

Inventing is not easy and as you can see from the comments above, inventors do not always present themselves or their products well to business. Inventors are often preyed upon by others; Ironically, I once paid $250 to an organisation supposedly set up to help fund innovation to be told that my invention was not innovative enough to get funding. Inventors, being typically individuals, are often treated with little respect; I once had to write to a Company Director because his staff would not provide me with an electrical certificate of suitability for one of his products. I also had to take an International Company to Court because they did not do the job I paid them four thousand dollars to do. (When I put the problem to them, they were not prepared to fix up their error. I won the case but it put everything back 18 months). Inventors are undoubtedly often their own worst enemy; they often seem to look only for positive feedback hence they miss important issues or concerns. This can cost them much in terms of money and even personal relationships and the media have often featured stories of the effect of an inventive endeavour on the spouse and family. I have found that government organisations set up to supposedly help inventors have costs and agendas such that they also are counter-productive and even damaging to the inventor in terms of time and money. Very little on offer is free or, in my opinion, accessible, except to the already successful inventor/Company. Believe it or not, as an inventor, the most helpful government organisation I have liaised with has been the ATO.

I could go on, but I won’t. But as we all know, it is much harder to create than it is is to destroy.

In summary, I personally do not think that this site is the place for inventors or inventions, but if you are a business person, please keep in mind what I said about inventors, and give them a bit of leeway.

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Tooth pick Reply:
October 14th, 2009 at 9:38 am

Phillip, Let’s tell it like it is. We are not talking about Mother Theresa here, we are talking about an individual trying to make THEIR fortune.Yep, it is hard … and expensive.

I still see the “everyone wants to steal my idea” thread in your text. Know what, they do and if you don’t have any IP, money to protect it if you do have it and money to go to court (or litigation insurance) if you are wronged, they will steal it. It’s called business. Other businesses deal with it every day. Hungry Jacks is not putting Cafe section into their stores … didn’t McDonalds invent that and make a mozza out of it the last few years? There is a reason why speed to market is a favoured strategy. It’s the inventor’s responsibility to understand this stuff or to be able to pay someone who does.

You should add to your text that if you can’t afford it don’t start and then complain about government, business or anyone else not giving you money … most inventors need help more than money although it’s not what they think.

I had a guy tell me once, having lost his business and house chasing the dream and told me that he did not have the commercial skill, the money or the engineering skill to get his invention to market. But he could see that there was a chance at fame and fortune if he kept going, so with so much invested stopping was not an option. Stopping is ALWAYS an option. Inventors should get familiar with Stage Gate, or something similar. The gates are there for a reason. This is why large companies do invent a huge number of new things but take few of them to market. There is a lesson in that.

Inventors should know the costs involved before they start:

Patent – $200k for 10 countries to get through to an issued patent
Design for manfucture – $?
Business Planning
Operating Expenses
Selling Expenses
etc
etc

The whole system does inventors a massive dis-service by ‘fluffing their pillows’ and ‘putting air in their tyres’ all the time. Telling them the reality of invention (cost, time, pain and suffering, frustration, prospect of getting financed, etc) would be a lot kinder, although I accept there’s no warm fuzzy from telling someone the truth?????

The prospect of Anthill joining the ‘what a great idea, you should mortgage your house’ crew is concerning. There are plenty of people doing it already.

Cheers.

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James Tuckerman Reply:
October 14th, 2009 at 10:06 am

It’s been great reading these comments and certainly has us thinking.

In terms of purpose and process, I imagine a sign-up form that demands thought be put into these sorts of issues – a form that poses commercial questions, about competition, distribution strategies and scale, rather than ‘how many colours does it come in?’

The form would also demand images and video, raising the barrier to entry (only reasonably advanced innovators would have those tools of promotion).

The final published item would be selected by our editorial crew (not just a forum free-for-all) and the commercial considerations (full text, including weaknesses) would be published along with the video and pics.

Finally, feedback would also be geared around commercial considerations (not simply ‘like/don’t like’). It’s important that feedback be constructive and NOT be provided by anonymous hecklers.

That’s the sort of process that is beginning to form in our minds.

Watch this space.

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Quick update: We’re working on a concept to formalise this process. We’re wondering whether to include a nominal fee (like $25). We do something similar with the Cool Company Awards application and that small barrier to entry really sorts out the wheat from the chaff (plus of course, we could only feasibly run five reviews a week).

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If this is going to work, individuals and companies, intending to promote their product, service, or idea this way, need to be made aware of a few things before they do.

Firstly they have to take the good with the bad and not engage or take issue with respondents’ comments, as has been the case here. Perhaps anyone associated with the product being promoted should be excluded from commenting altogehter.

Secondly, people need to be made aware of the risks they take if their IP is not adequately protected.

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Crazy Inventor Reply:
November 1st, 2009 at 8:49 pm

Good comments. Tim’s comment here and above about ready to launch plus James’ suggestion to charge a nominal fee should all work together well. It really needs to be ready to launch not ‘ideas and feedback’. Should be good!

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